a near-incessant ramble about sci-fi and fantasy novels and their language

[nerakrose]

Top 100 science fiction and fantasy books

I've read some of the books on this list and some are on my to-read list, while some I've heard of and some I haven't. But I noticed something - none or very few have been translated into English from some other language (I know Verne is on the list, but are there others?). And it got me thinking.
Do you lovely people on my flist, know of a fantasy or sci-fi book/series in your mother tongue (if it's not English, that is) that is really good/popular and either not translated or not on the list?

I'm really curious, because this language thing intrigues me. Many English-language fantasy/sci-fi novels get translated into a zillion languages, but it seems to me that there's not much traffic the other direction. It's a bit like a one-way high way... I discovered the other day that the Mortal Instruments series by Cassandra Clare has been translated into Danish and most recently Clockwork Angel. Christopher Paolini's Inheritance Cycle series has been translated into Danish. Eoin Colfer's Artemis Fowl series has been translated into Danish. Anne Rice has been translated into Danish. We all know JKR has been translated into everything. I could mention several more, but let's stop here.

I remember that most of the fantasy and sci-fi novels I read in my youth (and I say youth because I had a massive break of a few years between 15-20 where I didn't read much at all) all had foreign names on the cover.
I read *everything*. I've read several variations on witch!fantasy (magical-object-gives-you-powers, evil-neighbour-witch, witch-in-high-school, prophecied!witch, etc.), elf!fantasy (musical!elves, tree!lelves, secret!lelves, etc.), alien-invasion!sci-fi (alien!masters & human!servants, aliens-in-zoo, post-apocalyptic-alien-invasion, etc.), technologically-advanced-world!sci-fi (instant cloning, children in fake uteruses, children getting sucked into video games, etc.), and...a zillion others.
It was and probably always will be my favourite genre, but fact remains: all this shit was translated. A lot of it was read while I still lived in Iceland and Iceland has a rather terrifying amount of books to be released every year, of both translated and native lit. I never wanted for anything, but you know what? I can't recall a single Icelandic fantasy or sci-fi author. Maybe it's just because fantasy and sci-fi don't exist as separate genres in Icelandic lit - we usually split books into "fiction", "child lit", "poetry", "non-fiction" and "translated fiction" and "translated child lit". within "fiction" there's a subclass called "spennusögur" which roughly translates to "exciting stories". That's where we dump crime novels, adventure and probably also fantasy and sci-fi. I actually think it's pretty interesting because the Icelandic people is a remarkably literate nation. We have a literacy rate of 100% and the most common christmas gift is a BOOK. We read everything, regardless of what it is - the same tendency is very prevalent in the cinema. We don't classify films as anything but "films". Everyone sees everything and this is the main reason why many films premiere in Iceland weeks before they premiere elsewhere in the world; if the Icelanders like the film - it's a success. But I digress.

Some stuff in Danish (translated and untranslated):

The Shamer Chronicles by Lene Kaaberbøl which I have to confess I'm really surprised to discover has been translated. It's also the only one I've been able to find that's been translated into English. I read this series back in 2003, partially for class (the first book) and partially because I really liked it (the rest of the series). YA fantasy novels.

Something I think is worth mentioning - you all know the comic series W.I.T.C.H ? I used to be a big fan and I drew fanart and shit for it. also back in 2003 or earlier. Anyway, above mentioned author wrote 9 books for the series for Scandinavia/Denmark, but she was forced to write them in English and then have them translated to Danish for the Danish releases, instead of the other way around. (I've read these books too. I think I owned like three of them at some point...)

Jarastavens Vandring and Blodsbröder by Saga Borg (pseudonym). I thought these were Danish, but are actually Swedish. They've been translated to Danish and Norwegian only so far as I can see. I haven't read them but they've been on my to-read list since forever. YA fantasy novels.

Morganas Kilder by Helle Ryding, a trilogy that's been on my to-read list since forever as well. YA fantasy novels and quite famous. Not translated to any language at all. Draws heavily on nordic mythology, according to several online sources.

There's a bunch of other Danish authors that haven't been translated at all, such as Kenneth Bøgh Andersen.

And I wonder why this is so - Many of these are YA and it's tempting to think that they're not taken seriously as sci-fi/fantasy and therefore no one bothers translating them, but why should that be so? We have zillions English-language YA fantasy/sci-fi translated into Danish. Just look at the authors I mentioned in the beginning of this post. Or is it maybe that foreign language fantasy/sci-fi is deemed "unworthy" ? Must good fantasy/sci-fi be written in English to get recognition? One thing is recognition within a country's own boundaries (Kenneth Bøgh Andersen has won several awards, for example, and Lene Kaaberbøl is widely reknown for being one of the best children and YA lit authors we have), but is it necessary to get recognition outside of these boundaries (=be translated into English) to be deemed a good fantasy/sci-fi writer, someone who's worth reading?

Or is it maybe that Scandinavian fantasy/sci-fi is too nordic and not universal enough? We have proud mythological roots and we aren't afraid of exploiting them in our fiction. But maybe the key here is that good stuff must be unplaceable? generic? That it's only "good" if it's completely made up? Only, that argumentation doesn't hold much water since fantasy ultimately builds upon centuries-old superstitions and mystical creatures and beliefs that we thinking creatures have created. There's only so many ways you can re-create an elf or a dwarf, right? There's only so many supernatural powers you can afflict humans with, right? But is it true that fantasy derived from mythological sources isn't proper fantasy? HMM. Anyone remember Percy Jackson?
But maybe that doesn't count because it's Greek mythology and Greek and Roman stuff has a rather elevated cultural status in the Western world at large?

My mind is boggling and I seem to have forgotten what the point of this post was.

Comments

[inside-the-veil.livejournal.com]

I must say I'm fairly wary of that list (god, I always am wary of lists like that, am I?) in terms of criteria used for selection. I mean yes, Dune, 1984, LotR, etc. surely belong there because they're like, the epitome of sci fi and fantasy, respectively and furthermore have a pretty heavy political message, but some of that stuff - really??? e.g. Time Traveler's wife is a shitty book and I'd call it neither sci fi nor fantasy - the time travelling element still doesn't make it anything other than a bad sappy and disturbing chick lit romance novel, IMO. The Thrawn Trilogy? I've read it and it's good, but it's fucking Star Wars fanfic? Also, a bunch of the novels in the list look to me like they're the standard ripoff wannabe LotR with a fantasy world peopled by elvish/orcish/dwarfish people, fancy languages and a wagonload of epic magic rules and prophecies. Not saying they're bad, but does originality count for anything? <.<


As for non-English fantasy/sci fi, the only one I can think of off the top of my head is Wolfgang Holbein. Otfried Preußler wrote "Krabat", which is a tale about a wizard's apprentice, that's the other thing that comes to my mind, but his books are mostly for children and feature elements that could just as well be called "fairy tale" (another point that makes me doubt the validity of the list above).

[inside-the-veil.livejournal.com]

Also, I must admit I've only seen the movies for Watership Down and Princess Bride, but rather than fantasy, I'd shove them into the fairy tale direction - I considered them fairy tales like Snow White etc. as a kid. Metafictionality (as mentioned in the Princess Bride description) doesn't change that - Grimm's fairy tales were metafictional in parts, explicitly so. It's narrative convention of old. Just like uhm, the fact that it's a story about talking animals (watershhip down) doesn't really make it fantasy, either. Or, if it does, Brothers Grimm, Andersen, etc. belong on that list. And a whole fuckload of myths that include magic.

I also haven't read Outlander, but my mum loves it, so I kind of know what it's about. And as far as I understand it, the novel is rather a historical novel than fantasy. The only fantasy element, I think, is the fact that Claire travels back in time, but the world she travels back to is 100% realistic. (My mum keeps going on how pages and pages of detailed battle descriptions and politics bore her :P).

I wonder why Bram Stoker is not on that list. Or, well, Conan Doyle wrote sci fi as well. Making History was, I think nominated? awarded? some sci-fi prize as well?

I'm getting warier and warier of that list the longer I think about it. I'll go get cake now. XD

[ballyharnon.livejournal.com]

OMGOMGOMG I didn't even notice Outlander was on that list.

OUTLANDER IS PORN. Just plain porn. Mary-Sue ridden self-insertion rape-fantasy porn.

[nerakrose]

Cake! :D

Yeah, the list is a bit pants (it was created on a reader/voter basis anyway), but it doesn't really change the fact that I've had a hard time finding foreign (as in, non-english) fantasy and sci-fi translated into English. There has to be some, but if there is, it hasn't been advertised as broadly as english-language stuff, which is what makes me wonder...

Yeah, there's some stuff missing. Also I think I saw Frankenstein on the list. I wouldn't call that sci-fi at all and those who do haven't understood what the book. *shrugs*

[ballyharnon.livejournal.com]

Hum, yeah, I agree with inside_the_veil that list is a little bit completely strange. I mean, there are classics on it, and there's total crap on it, like they ran out of books but were determined to do a 100-list. It's from NPR, so I suspect it must the the top 100 sci-fi and fantasy books for nerds living in America.

About the nordic myths; everyone loves myth, and I know anglophones have a soft spot in their hearts for nordic myth, we certainly have tons of film and book adaptations of them. :) I think this list is just sort of pants.

[nerakrose]

haha! maybe it is. it was created on a reader/voter basis kinda thing. I'd like to see a list made by a bunch of fantasy and sci-fi geeks or people who have researched the shit to hell and back and actually know what they're talking about. XD

so I should actually go ahead with my other fantasy novel/chronicles/thing that I was going to base on the nordic myths? :P

[ballyharnon.livejournal.com]

YES YOU SHOULD!!

[brighty18.livejournal.com]

It's from NPR, so I suspect it must the the top 100 sci-fi and fantasy books for nerds living in America.

LOL. As mentioned in a previous comment, I've worked in several bookstores and we used to refer to certain customers/books/attitudes/music genres as being "NPR." Yes, I do sometimes listen to NPR (and Andrew worked for an NPR station in college), but there is a definite "type" of NPR listener. They tend to be white, traditionally liberal, well-educated, and middle class. They're to the left of center, but not outside-the-box thinkers who really go out and explore alternative ideas or lifestyles**. Instead, they like to read about said alternative ideas and lifestyles in safe, easy packages.

And those are totally the types of people who would make that list!


***Note: When I say "alternative lifestyles" I don't mean being gay. I mean stuff like communal living, traveling the world with no money and a backpack, living off-grid, Anarchists, radical activists, or those who live by The Scavenger's Manifesto.

[brighty18.livejournal.com]

That's an interesting list. I've read quite a few of those, but some not at all. For example, I'm not fond or Orson Scott Card at all. Also, this may be embarrassing to admit, but I've started Snow Crash several times, but was unable to finish it.

And speaking of "finish" or "Finnish" (ha ha, bad pun), have you ever read Troll: A Love Story by Johanna Sinisalo? It's really more like Magic Realism than pure fantasty/sci-fi, but it's pretty cool.

[nerakrose]

Those I hadn't heard of until I saw that list... but I've got a few of the books on that list at home waiting for me.

No, I haven't actually! I'm aware it exists but Johanna Sinisalo is a bit hard to find here in DK... I'll have better luck next month once I'm in Finland.

[inside-the-veil.livejournal.com]

They have it at the secondhand bookstore with the giant cellar in Tampere. :P That's where I got it. (but other stores should do, too, I guess. The book got awards, as far as I remember)

[inside-the-veil.livejournal.com]

*chirps in*

I've had Sinisalo sitting on my shelf for ages... in the original, though, and I never got around to reading it, but now I think I might just make time for it... I know what it's about and it sounded so awesome, so I had to buy it when I saw it...

[felak-gundu.livejournal.com]

One of the few German authors coming to my mind is Cornelia Funke and her Tintenherz/Inkheart novels. I don't know in which other languages her stories have been translated, though. Germany has loads of fantasy stuff out ... though most of it is pretty mediocre. Which also can be said of a lot of the books out in English, thinking about it ... ;)
Holbein is writing incessantly, I don't know when this guy sleeps ... I'm not a fan but I know he is selling well here. The role playing community of Das Schwarze Auge publishes loads and loads of accompanying novels, though to my mind, you can find better written fanfic ;).
From dealing with British and American publishers I know that they just don't look to other countries and it is damn hard to sell German rights to them. German publishers, in contrast, are quite open, or used to be, though they nowadays start looking for own talent - not because they believe there are good writers out there, but because this is cheaper than paying for the translation ;).

[nerakrose]

I've heard of Inkheart, coming to think of it. Any good?

paying for translations seems to be a problem all over. publishing houses here in DK don't want to pay for the translations anymore - the established translators can afford to decline a manuscript if they aren't offered enough money for it (dunno what it's like elsewhere, but here translators get a one time fee for the translation and then a library fee. the woman who translated Harry Potter has earned fuckloads just from library fees), whereas new translators are desperate and take anything they can get, which...yeah, doesn't exactly help the quality.

[brighty18.livejournal.com]

I enjoyed those books.

[mrs-jack-turner.livejournal.com]

Phone won't open the link for some reason :( Will look later.

I could read scifi/fantasy books forever and ever. I love them far too much. There's just so much you can do with it and it's so much fun. I considered reading some Anne Rice in french in the hopes that it would help me pick it up more quickly, but never got around to it.

[nerakrose]

That's how I got fluent in English :D not with Anne Rice, but I read the Earth's Children series and Harry Potter and now I'm a BAMF in English. XD

[shahar-amar.livejournal.com]

I can only echo the names Funke and Holbein and add Michael Ende (Momo, The Neverending Story) to the list of German language YA F/SF authors.

Kirsten is probably right about English language publishers not looking abroad for talent. And if you look at the amount of books written in english every year, be it by established authors or hopefuls adding to the slush pile every literary agent and publishing house gets sent unbidden, they probabyl don't have to.

I mean, Funke only got her work translated by sheer luck, even though she was already very successful here. One German family moved to Britain because of the fathers job, the daughter told her schoolfriends about those great books she loved, but they couldn't find and one of the friends bugged her father, who happened to be in publishimg to do something about it. That's luck and coincidence, the right elements coming together in a way that rarely happens.

[nerakrose]

Yeah, it does seem so. It looks like non-English countries are better at translating each other than English-speaking countries are at translating non-English stuff.

Talk about luck, yeah. :)

[http://users.livejournal.com/_likimeya/]

Michael Ende, definitely. The Night of Wishes is my personal favourite, it's super adorable and heart-warming.
A really, really great and relatively recent German fantasy trilogy are the books Lycidas – Lilith – Lumen by Christoph Marzi. I don't think they've been translated (yet). Have you heard of them?
I can't think of anything else right now that I think would deserve a place on any best-of list I'd make. I'm not a great fan of (contemporary as well as older) German literature, and I haven't read that much else can't think of anything else that I'd recommend. In my opinion, there aren't many German authors who put captivating storytelling before pompously flaunting their self-attested virtuosity when writing a book…

I must admit, I only quickly read through the list because I don't think much of such lists or any sort of book canon thing in general. However, I noticed that Slaughterhouse Five is on it. ROFL! It's so weird, seeing that counted among science fiction novels like the Hyperion Cantos and Contact, just because there's talk of aliens in it. *rolls eyes*

[nerakrose]

Not heard of him. I did a quick google and it looks like he's not translated.
Haha :D Not having read much German stuff I can't say if I agree, but I picked up a German book secondhand not long ago and it basically starts with "It was a dark and stormy night" XD I LOLed. Haven't read it yet.

Well the list is a bit wonky, so there's definitely stuff on there that shouldn't be (like those you mentioned) and there is missing stuff too... :)

[annoyedannushka.livejournal.com]

I could be wrong, but very few books originally written in another language make their way to the US. I can't think of any fantasy/sci-fi books. I think Hollywood would have to get a hold of the story for them to get translated.

Robin Hobb's on the list! You should check out her trilogies (Farseer, Tawny Man, & Liveship Traders). You might like them. They're popular with the Finns.

[nerakrose]

I wouldn't be surprised if it were so. :P

I've got one Robin Hobb book! I haven't read it yet. I also don't remember which one it is but I'm fairly sure it's the first one in a trilogy. I picked it up secondhand ages ago.

[mrs-jack-turner.livejournal.com]

Ok, so I've not seen the list. I feel so bad that I haven't read as many of these as I should have. What's worse, is the amount of books on that list that I am in possession of and have yet to read.

C.S. Lewis had a space trilogy? Did not know that.

[nerakrose]

I've read a fair few of the books on the list, but some shouldn't be on it in the first place. *shrugs*

I had no idea either O.o